i2M or G2M?

The i2M musicport™ MIDI Converter & Hi-Z USB Audio Interface

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GnarlFox
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i2M or G2M?

Post by GnarlFox »

EDIT: I posted in the wrong forum so I deleted it and reposted.

What is the difference between the G2M and the i2M? Amazon has the i2M listed as being on sale since 2004. Is that correct? Is version 3 of G2M out in the wild, and if so, are they stocked? I'd rather get an i2M because I don't have MIDI cables, and it's more convenient, but if the new G2M sports better specs then I'd rather get that. I'd like to use whichever sonuus product is best for bass, voice, and piccollo bass, and perhaps guitar or electronic drums down the line.

I also noticed a post about a 24bit audio interface, and that sonuus was going to announce three new products at NAMM this year, but I couldn't find a specific article. I did find out about version 3 of G2M and the Kickstarter so maybe those might be two of them. Is there somewhere I can hear about it? I checked the sonuus Facebook page and the news page.

Thanks!
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james
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by james »

Hello,

(Thanks for moving this to the correct place!)

The i2M wasn't introduced in 2004! Sonuus was only formed in 2009 :-)

The i2M has been available since 2011. However, the firmware of the i2M has been updated regularly. The latest firmware update (1.40) was done at the end of 2015. This new firmware is very similar to what is in the new G2M V3.

The main difference is that the G2M uses a 5-pin MIDI and is great to interface with other MIDI hardware. It can be battery powered or powered via a 9V supply, so it works on pedalboards. The i2M is USB, so best with a computer / iPad. So I think you are best to get an i2M.

The new G2M V3 isn't out in the wild. We had some pre-production units, but these sold quickly. We are expecting production units towards the end of April 2016.

The 24-bit audio interface is the X2M musicport. We showed this at NAMM, but we haven't scheduled when this will be released yet because we have had our hands full with other products (new G2M , and the Loopa microphone -- which is currently on Kickstarter).

The best place to get news is to sign up to our newsletter (you can do this from the top of www.sonuus.com web page).
GnarlFox
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by GnarlFox »

Thanks for the quick response, and information. I signed up to the newsletter. I think I'll wait for the X2M because I'd really like to use two inputs at the same time, and because I should probably pay off some of the music gear I've bought recently first. Thanks again :)
Jonners
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by Jonners »

I'm going to try piggy backing on this thread.

I thought about the i2M to use my guitar to play synths on Propellerheads Reason. No problem, I'm sure, might take some config on midi channels etc, but I'll get there.

Then it suddenly occurred to me, that I could use a guitar to control my Moog Sub 37. But for that, the obvious choice is the G2M.

I've got a Steinberg UR22 that could take the MIDI from the G2M into the PC.

But, the i2M offers a lot more in terms of config and the editor etc, and I could get the Kenton USB to Midi converter.

As I see it, I get the best PC connection with the i2M, but have to spend more to get the Kenton to drive the Sub37 and that might add latency.

Or, I get the best Sub37 connection with the G2M, but might suffer latency issues to the PC with the addition of the Steinberg.

So, the question, are there any more subtle pros and cons of the two options I ought to be aware of? And (not that I'll hold you responsible for my choice) what would you do?
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james
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by james »

I would choose the G2M. The latency with the Sub 37 will be lowest with this configuration and it will feel a little snappier.

I expect the extra latency added by the Steinberg UR22 to be low (1-2ms max) compared to the additional latency of the audio buffers used for a software instrument.

If you later find you want more MIDI control for computer use, get an i2M as well: a G2M + i2M costs less than an i2M + Kenton USB-Host.

The new G2M (Version 3) has a few more configuration options compared to the previous G2M so there's still some tweaking you can do.

The only thing I'm not sure of is what MIDI pitch-bend range the Sub 37 supports. The G2M allows pitch-bend of (+/-) 2, 5, 12, 36. As long as the Sub 37 can match one of those, pitch bend from the guitar will be played correctly on the synth.
Jonners
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by Jonners »

Now that's the sort of rational thinking I needed! The i2M and the G2M is better than the Kenton. Blinding flash of the obvious.

Yep, that works. G2M for now, and i2M if I need it. Thank you for the clear thought.

What's pitch bend? I play on 13's. :-)

The manual has this on the CC reference ... would that work?

PITCH BEND UP AMOUNT 107 0..+24 SEMITONES
PITCH BEND DOWN AMOUNT 108 0..+24 SEMITONES
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james
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by james »

Short answer -- that looks good, it should work. You can set it to 2, 5, or 12 to match the G2M.

A quick lesson on MIDI pitch bend.

The pitch-bend controller sends a number (14-bits) to represent an amount of bend. How much this bends at the limits is not defined, it's up to the synth to set this. Usually it's symmetric (up-bend is the same as down-bend) but it doesn't need to be (however our MIDI converters assume it is symmetric).

So if you set the bend (up and down) to be 2 semitones, the pitch wheel on the synth will let you bend up and down by 2 semitones.

Now on guitar, you can bend up and down as much as you want (if you have a tremolo), or maybe 2 to 3 semitones when bending strings with your fingers. The G2M (or i2M) needs to know how to convert this amount of bend into a number to send to the synth. If the G2M is set to 2 semitones, when you bend up by 2 semitones, it will send the maximum number. Similarly, if you bend down by 2 semitones, it will send the minimum number.

If your synth is set to match this 2 semitone range, every bend on the guitar will match what the synth plays.

But if the synth and G2M are not set to match you get strange results. If the G2M range is set to 2 semitones, but they synth is set to 12 semitones. Bending by 2 semitones on your guitar will sent the maximum pitch-bend number. The synth receives this and bends its maximum, which is now 12 semitones. You by making a small bend on guitar, you bend the synth by an octave! Sometimes this can be fun, but it's usually not desired.

To help with this MIDI defines a "pitch-bend range" RPN message that you can send to the synth to let it know what range to set. Both the G2M and i2M send this message. Unfortunately, a lot of synths ignore it, so you end up having to set it manually on the synth. If the synth supports this it makes it much easier.
Jonners
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by Jonners »

Thanks. OK, big intake of breath - order placed for G2M Wahoo and Voluum.

I'll update you on progress. Looking forward to:

1) Adding the Wahoo onto the Sub 37 to add more filtering options and playing around with noise filtering.

2) Using the G2M, if I can, to trigger the Moog whilst using the guitar signal on the Audio In path (this is one of the issues with audio in, it still needs something to trigger the modulation).

3) And, just for fun, using the G2M with my trumpet 'Silent Brass' mute (effectively a mic in the bell) and putting it into Reason.
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james
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by james »

Cool... I'm looking forward to an update once you've had a play!
krisbg
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Re: i2M or G2M?

Post by krisbg »

Hello,
I will use the opportunity to ask in this thread. I would like to use G2M or i2M with a fretless bass, and am wondering how they would handle long glissandi over several semitones - will it be smooth, or quantized, and even if it is smooth, will it be handled properly without configuring the synth pitch-bend range for each glissando specifically. As far as I understand from what is written above - if the synth (Behringer Deepmind 12) supports "pitch-bend range" RPN message, I guess it should handle properly the glissando as a long pitch-bend, and I could play with different glissando lengths in one musical piece, without having to touch the synth, while if the synth doesn't allow it, I should manually set the pitch-bend range on it, and play only glissandi, which are with the selected number of semitones? Or maybe I should set the synth pitch-bend range to only one semitone in each direction, and G2M will handle a longer glissando as a series of note and short pitch-bends from semitone to next semitone?
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